2010 Videos - Bushmaster (ACR & MCR400)

Bushmaster

MCR400 looks interesting. Probably ridiculously priced as well. I wish em luck.

and you know its good because it says BUSHMASTER on it I think u can read that shit from space

edit: saw the acr video ...fuck maybe when its cheaper

if you can afford 338 lapua ammo you probably don't give a shit.

"shrubmaster"

well then... at least their rep didn't just rattle off some bullshit mumblings that sound like Obama defending his health care reform....oh wait....nevermind.

The ACR seems kinda large.

No comments on the "published" 8.2lb weight to go along with the "published" MSRP?

It sounded like that rep really wanted to say:

"Hey, Guys! It's $3,000 because we had to build a quality rifle this time around, and not our usual shoddy crap...."

I interpreted as:

- we're going after .mil contracts and we had to throw a lot of R&D $ into it than we thought
- since the quality is as good/better than a SCAR, we are pricing it around the SCAR
- Remington ACR and Bush ACR has to be different so .mil knows they're getting slightly differentiated product - e.g., 1/9 vs 1/7 twist
- civvie market will have to bear some of the overall ACR R&D costs

PRICE = FAIL

I agree completely that unless the ACR gets adopted by military and/or law enforcement agencies that this rifle will only be purchased by a select few collectors/enthusiasts given the MASSIVE price point.

+1

Glad he feels good about their pricing...wonder if they will still feel good about pricing when they have a warehouse full of rifles that most folks cannot afford.

He's good! Says that crap with a straight face!

Sad but true. He said we weren't going to cut corners on this product. Oh really? Why the 1/9 twist barrel that isn't chrome lined? How about the weight? Idiot

And he CLEARLY pull MagPul into the shit storm...

At least BM have a spoke person to give the face (and speak crap) to the pissed crowd. Im still waiting for a Magpul explanation.

Why the M4/203 notch also?

I feel like kicking a baby.........

That the same thought I had.

1/9 = FAIL

I'll keep my Sig 556, and when I get another EBR, it will be the LMT piston version.

You beat me to it!

Why don't they just shut the fuck up about the R&D, coatings, not willing to downgrade parts blah blah blah; it's all 100% bullshit. If the material and coatings were so damned exotic it seems like the DIRECTOR of marketing would have mentioned that in his poorly prepared sales pitch.

The barrel configuration sucks, to save money/increase margin they kept the barrel profile exactly the same. They'll probably say the 203 notch is to get better access to the piston. meh - I could go on and on. I'm so glad I haven't had a Masada boner for the past 3 years. What are the chances the barrel is something other than 4140?

Did Bushmaster buy the MCR from Cobb? It looks like really similar to this interesting none the less

That was a good laugh.

I may be wrong but I do believe bushmaster/Cerebus bought out Cobb

Naturally, I did not expect the BM rep to be repentant about a new product. However, his edge of arrogance and lack of material support for his claims are simply irritating. I noticed that he didn't talk about accuracy. Their greatest competition, the SCAR, is known to be match accurate. Oh, and it's cheaper. Although I certainly like the features of the ACR, it appears bulky, unwieldy and long (I also think the SCAR is a bit unwieldy and long). The other point I would have liked addressed is will they sell short barrels to folks who register it as an SBR, and what twist(s).

Bushy owns Cobb, since 2007. See link below, scroll down on the page to the Notable acquisitions section, Firearms

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerberus_Capital_Management

News flash, they bought COBB as well, this is why they own the BA50 now.

ETA: Damn I was beat

Congrats shrubmaster!!! you get the marketing f@$k up of the year award!!!

After all this wait, what a let down! I guess I'll be buying something else this year.

Why can't anyone say the word "ambidextrous" properly? There is only one "I" in ambidextrous!! What a Billy Bobb

As a sales person in the technology space, the Product Managers I've worked with make a point of traveling in the field to take customer feedback back to corporate for product development. They also work diligently to understand their competition so they can provide product differentiation.

I will concede that major vendors selling AR15 type rifles are selling 1:9 barrels. Examples are Bushmaster themselves, DPMS, Rock River, Oly Arms. Even the boutique build it yourselfers like J&T and Del-Ton are selling a majority of 1:9 barrels. This PM thinks that those 1:9 customers are going to be stepping up to buy the ACR at an outrageous pricepoint. He may get a few, but for most of these "uneducated" 1:9, non-MPI customers, they prefer a CHEAP rifle and do not bother looking at competitive differentiators. That is this guy's target audience, not us.

What Bushmaster is forgetting is that folks who were considering laying down $1500 for an ACR are "educated" AR-users/buyers who want Colt, LMT, Noveske-type quality and demand a 1:7 barrel.

Bushmaster and Magpul could have eliminated this shitstorm if they would have elicited feedback from the "educated" AR community, as Charles Daly did. As a result, CD put out a quality rifle and offered users a 1:7 barrel based on feedback here. The don't ask don't tell secrecy policy from Bushmaster/Magpul put them completely in the dark on what users wanted in the ACR and will ultimately kill their rifle sales.

Haven't you learned? We have no idea what we need or want. The industry experts that work for some of these outfits are so far advanced and important that they don't have time to talk with the shooters about what they want or need. Now get back in line and get your credit card out, they'll let you know when you can order. Again, don't forget to order a sling if you're getting the basic ACR.

Shrubmaster will decide what the mass market needs. Again, this is another example of a product that was hyped, and fell short is many, many aspects.

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No kidding. Also, one more question...why no Magpul sling???

With the rising prices of commodities, labor and materials, I can understand why this rifle costs more than $2k. However, they did not respect the integrity of the rifle by giving us a 1x9" twist. I think it's great they're giving us a Blackout FH, Magpul BUIS and BlueForce sling on the enhanced model. However, they did not obviously listen to us or Magpul by giving us a 1x9" twist barrel.

To get this rifle in more people's hands, they need to knock $500-600 off the enhanced model's price. That would put it in line with the Noveske switchblock Recce N4 light models. I mean, that is essentially their only competition here IMHO, besides the FN SCAR. I understand raw material pricing and the pain of bringing a new product to market, but they didn't bother listening to consumers (read: AR-15.com consumers who pay $2-3k for their ARs....not your typical joe-bobs) when it came to what they wanted.

You know, I really do think that part of the block here is because Bushmaster makes AR-15s to begin with. The AR is such a ubiqutous platform. Likewise, it is a huge money maker for Bushmaster. I really think they don't want to see their AR sales undercut by a new, perhaps BETTER rifle, like the ACR.

Bushmaster, if you're reading this, I'll still buy an ACR if you give me a 1x7" barrel twist like the military will get and if you knock off $500 from the price. Otherwise, I have no reason to give you $3k for a rifle when I can buy a Noveske switchblock upper, build my own lower + stock AND buy an Aimpoint to top it off for less than what you're wanting for the ACR.

There only competition are the numerous established AR companies out theree already producing top quality and proven rifles (LMT, Colt, Noveske, BCM) to name a few. And all can be had in some form or another in the 1000-1500 range.

For the price of an ACR, I can have a complete LMT with an Accupoint in mount 2 thousand rounds of ammo and still have money to buy at least 5-10 mags....... To me that says volumes to there bloated price point!

ETA: 1/9 is a joke as well. Looks like they are just doing some spring cleaning and getting rid of shit they couldnt otherwise sell.

The MS2 has outsourced parts, and I believe they have had trouble keeping up with demand. Maybe they will offer the MS3 when it becomes avaliable, that's has components made in house.

Such a shame that they had to fuck up a nice rifle.

1/9 non chrome lined
fixed stock
no rails

for $2700???

military grade rifle that comes with a non-mil spec barrel?!?!

+1

Shrubmaster is the new HK.....be cause we hate you.

Don't worry as there is always a chance they will produce an "enhanced military" version with the following features:
Mil-Spec 1/7 chrome lined barrel
"Metal" flip up sights
weight less then 8lbs.
Nervermind as that version will cost 4k

Military isn't going to go with a 1:9 twist and they aren't going to like a barrel that's not chrome lined. I think it would be a damn hard sell to get DOD to go with an 8.2 lbs rifle when a soldier is already asked to carry a ton of weight.

Good Luck to them they're going to need it.

He kept a straight face, but look at his eyes the whole time he's talking about the price.

The Remington-made ACR's are suppposed to sport 1:7 bbl. & weigh 7#. The BM knock-off is different in these aspects & that, in addition to the steep price-point, is probably the rub w/ the market audience that was interested in this piece from the get. For that much coin, nothing should have been missed. I can't figure the source of the dramatic weight difference, but at some point that'll be known.

I'd add that the M203 bbl step-cut is stupid, indicating that BM's pulling M4gery bbls. from the parts warehouse & slapping them on, which lends a "cobbled together" impression of the product, as if it's an amalgam of a pile of parts, rather than a purpose-built from the ground up unit. Magpul never displayed a Masada prototype w/ a step-cut in the bbl., & while I'm sure it'll function, for 3 G's it just lends the impression of a cheap, corner-cutting manuever.

Mk16S for me.

I was at Shotshow the weight didn't feel like 8.2lb. I would say the weight felt the same as a base model M4 clone. Felt very balanced and not front heavy like some piston guns. Other than the high price great gun.

These dumbasses at BM are going to sell a shit-ton of Colt and BCM CHF rifles. BCM and Colt need to put these ass-clowns on thier Chirstmas card list and send them videos of them laughing all the way to the bank with the money they made off of pissed-off potential Masada customers who won't buy this ACR shit.

Not that that it makes the acr any cheaper. But I thought I read something back when
magpul still was designing the acr, that you could put any ar barrel on the rifle with just
installing their racheting divice on your standard ar barrel. Does any body know if that
is still true, or did i dream the whole thing up?

please delete

You know with just a few minor changes, they probably could get their MSRP with a minimum of bitching. If I were asked to come in and save their asses, I would do the following:



I would guess that with those four changes I could increase sales, at the same price point, by 30-40%.

What are your ideas for improving the situation while maintaining the same price?

It's also probably worth noting that the ACR does not appear to have a FA, unlike the SCAR where the CH does double-duty as FA. While most hated the SCAR reciprocating CH, I thought it was a clever & simple implementation, & I bet time will prove its simplicity & functionality to be a benefit in the field.

1:33 in the video in this thread. It does have the forward assist. The only two drawbacks I've heard about the reciprocating CH with the SCAR has been when the CH impacts a barricade, sling, or the users reaction side hand it cause a malfunction. I have also heard of the CH getting sheered off, but I suppose that can happen to any gun w/ a protruding CH.

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