Some Thoughts On the USGI MOLLE Assault Pack - ETA: Tutorial W/PIX Added, Pg 2.

I've been playing around with a few of these for a while, and thought I'd share some minor findings.

First, a little history of the item.

The first Gen MOLLE assault pack (compared to the latest issue) is a tinch smaller in capacity overall. It has detachable shoulder straps with four mounting rings at top of pack. It lacks the four side compression straps, antenna ports, and frame sheet found on later models. It is not set up for an internal bladder.

IIRC, Gen II packs were as Gen I above, but added two antenna ports. Not too common.

Gen III (latest issue) has wider, non-detachable shoulder straps, and all the goodies the earlier versions lack.
It has some small strap loops atop the pack; maybe for a 8-inch diameter sleeping pad or such. The outer external pocket now has a zipper instead of the earlier drawstring. Both early and latest versions have a buckled flap for the pocket. The newer pack also has a non-load-bearing belly band.

All of these packs have buckles designed to attach them to the dorsal side of the main MOLLE rucksack, and are made to snap-in the GI 6X30-rd "bandolier" inside the outer pocket as well as being able to mount the GI waist pack on the bottom for added capacity. All will strap-in the GI radio pouch inside the main compartment (see pic in link)
http://stores.alleghenywholesale.com/-strse-603/GENUINE-U.S.-MILITARY-ISSUE/Detail.bok. Since the pack has zero internal organization, the radio pouch privides a little bit of subdivision of the main compartment. Better than the original nothing. The radio pouch also has some internal straps that might serve to anchor an internal bladder+bladder carrier.

These packs were originally intended for short-term use. The construction, while meeting GI-issue standards, is not up to top-tier levels. Then again, they are generally available for around $35 or so. For the most part, the main construction omission on the GI packs is the lack of bound edges of the fabric, something that is not hard––or expensive–– to remedy.

The Gen I can benefit from the addition of a frame sheet, or lacking that, maybe replacing the original foam padding sheet with an identical sheet of thin HDPE, but a sheet cut from a GI foam sleeping pad will do. Compression straps can be added by attaching Fastex QASM buckles to the PALS strips on the sides of the pack, and using a field-expedient tri-glide to anchor the nylon strap in the center of the pack.

These are decently-made packs, given the price. Their omissions can be remedied by the user for cheap. Both ACU and DCU camo patterns can be dyed using RIT Dk green dye into surprisingly good shades of greenish-base camo.

I think these packs are rather under-rated. They are not top-tier quality, but they can be made nearly so for peanuts. As mentioned, one can buy a few of 'em for the cost of one top-tier pack of similar dimensions.

For those of you on a budget, give them a look. Expect to spend mebbe an hour melting loose threads and searing raw edges of fabric––inside and out. Yes, take out the frame sheet and turn the thing inside-out.

Bottom line: Good for 72 hrs in any but extreme climates, as long as you do your part. NO WAY is this a winter pack. Might be a good idea to attach some GI/MOLLE 1-qt Canteen/Utility pouches to the sides of the pack. Not much bigger, IMHO.

All-in-all, a pretty good bargain if the user doesn't mind doing a little work. I have a Gen I, and two Gen III, FWIW.

It's garbage if you actually use it for it's intended use. I've never used my issue one.

Nice summary. Last year I spent some time chasing down components to set up four full MOLLE II rucks and found that the tw packs you speak of are referred to as the "Patrol Pack" (the drawstring outer pocket and detachable shoulder straps) and the "Assault Pack" (zipped outer pocket and non-detachable shoulder straps). After an unexpected eBay arrival I figured out the difference in product names. Thought this might help someone in their search-fu.

Your comment is entirely to the point, and I may have been inexact concrning official GI nomenclature.

I will examine the relevent items, and revise my original post with the proper nomenclature.

Thanks for the correction.

So, you've never used your pack, but somehow feel GTG to comment anyways?

Thanks for your comments.

I did the same them building 2 sets and some how I ended up with 2 different large ruck sacks. Now I am having a hard time finding the large DCU rucksack that has the sleep carrier built in the bottom. I found out I liked that bag better as it is much larger even with the sleep carrier built in.

I have whatever is the latest generation here in Afghanistan in multicam. I can say that it’s made out of some stout material and the frame is quite robust. Suspension is adequate; much better than any stock ALICE system, but nowhere close to Kifaru, Arc’Teyrx or Mystery Ranch systems. I personally don’t care for it, but I can say that it’s not a bad system with the two sustainment pouches and removable patrol pack. It’s not a pack I would want to bushwhack with unless it was stripped clean of external pouches, but for standard road marches and staying on well defined trails, I wouldn’t bitch too much about using it. It’s just hard to mass produce a pack that is going to durable and comfortable…and for a decent price.

ROCK6

In his defense, I don't think any of us in the mil have ever been able to use them for their intended use- they fail too soon. I've not seen one last when used by me or any of my guys, in person.

Simply put, the construction quality on these packs is insufficient to withstand the designed-for combat use. I've never had one survive the first fraction of a deployment, much less an entire one, and that has been repeated multiple times, with multiple packs. Without exception, every tour has seen me try to use this pack, and then transition to my own privately-purchased one when the issued one came apart.

They are fine for infrequent or light use- they have clever features and such. But the earlier comment of "made for peanuts" explains a lot- and many folks, especially in the SF, won't use or trust gear that can and will fail under real use.

If the new MC ones are better, then that is good news indeed.

i had nothing but problems with the original plastic frames breaking. since i upgraded to the latest version of the frame it hasn't been an issue at all for me anymore. that said i don't hump a ruck anymore. mine gets used as fancy dufflebag more than anything else. it does take a fair share of getting tossed in and out of my truck and has held up well with that.

i do agree, this is NOT the pack i want humping through the woods,way to much stuff to snag on and frankly to large.

I agree. I bought one for lugging tons of gear going with the wife and kids (I wasn't going to drop a ton of cash for a new big pack for this limited use item). For that purpose, I've been very happy. My tent fits in the sleep system carrier like it was made for it. It's not what I'd use on a solo weekend trip, but that's not why I bought it.... It's been on 3 trips and hasn't broken yet (I have the tan frame on mine).

It carries well under load (especially for <50 bucks, and with the sustainment pouches (my wife actually found some for pretty cheap and gave them to me) you can haul a surprising amount of crap.

Since I'm a water whore I also rigged up 3L water pouches where the sustainment pouches go as an experiment and that worked well also. I've played with this configuration but haven't taken it anywhere yet. There are probably pics floating around somewhere in the SF.

ETA: oops this thread appears to be about the assault pack not the main ruck... my bad.

What, exactly, is prone to failure on these packs? Generally speaking, the primary construction difference between most GI-issue gear and most top-tier gear is that the GI gear does not have the edges of the fabric taped and sewed with grosgrain ribbon. Thus, the raw edges of the fabric on most Gi gear is subject to abrasion and un-ravelling, which leads eventually to seam blow-out. It's not hard to re-sear the edges of raw fabric if they have just begun to unravel, nor is it hard or expensive to buy some grosgrain ribbon and sew it over the edges of the fabric, like the top-tier guys do.

My SDS DCU assault pack has finished edges. There's no tag on it so I can't get an NSN to verify that it's genuine USGI, but it's a dead ringer for the MOLLE assault packs I've seen. The only thing I've seen that makes me think it might not be USGI is it doesn't attach to my Gen 4 MOLLE II ruck because the buckles don't line up. But I'm thinking the assault pack may be an earlier generation. Anyway, it's pretty rugged, I carried it hiking and camping a lot last summer and it's my go-to bag when I go away for the weekend. Clothes for 3 days, hygiene stuff, and whatever I need for a day on the trail or night in the woods fit in it quite well. You can stuff more into it than would be comfortable carrying, that's for sure.

Just like you explained, the most common problems were blown out seams- including on parts where the pack then dumped its contents and on straps where they came off the pack. Also, I've had buckles break- the plastic simply breaking apart and failing. Those are the major ones that come to mind, and obviously I don't have the packs any more to eyeball them.

Nobody is going to resew their pack while its in use outside the wire. For multi-week ops, that just isn't reasonable to expect folks to do, and if that is needed even occasionally to keep the pack serviceable then it is not suitable for that application.

I have heard from one NCO that he had gear parties wherein his troops were told to clean-up their gear with Bic lighter and snips. He found the exerscise useful in that the troops were compelled to examine every inch of their gear, some finding flaws that caused the gear to be turned-in prior to failure. More importantly, the troops thereafter had something of a vested interest in their gear and overall apearance. A minor thing, perhaps, but a positive thing nevertheless.

I don't suggest that troops on active ops should even think about such things; they have more important things to worry about.

As the poster above mentioned, both my Gen III assault packs have their major seams taped properly. I just spent about 45 mins going over the whole thing, inside and out melting and searing loose threads and the occasional raw edge of fabric. The 3-color desert pack had seen some use, that is for sure; how much is tough to say. The amount of "finishing-by-Bic" required was really minimal, and the construction methods and overall quality rather better than I first stated above.

As far as buckles go, it is always good practice to toss one each of each type of buckle into a pocket on the pack. The Mil issues sets of field-expedient buckles with each pack, and you can buy sets of 'em dirt cheap.

I have no doubt these packs, like any piece of equipment, will fail, particularly if they are over-loaded as so often happens when one is in the field. It is not your fault if you are ordered to carry 75# in a pack designed for 40#, and under such circumstances, one should not be surprised if the pack fails prematurely. If used within their design/weight limits, I still maintain they are a relative bargain. YMMV.


If I am missing something, then set me straight. I am not arguing with you, simply trying to understand.

Raf-

You are the reason I bought a bag-o-buckles....

The buckles on the shoulder straps break often from my experience. You'll see commonly see the buckles taped up to hold things together.
It is not my preferred pack but while in the service I made it work when I needed to. Better then a laundry bag for hauling gear.

The only buckle on the shoulderstraps is the Emergency quick-release buckle. It WILL break if the user opens it up, and doesn't re-assemble it right. You have to really PUSH the male portion into the female part of the buckle, and only then try to snap down the QR portion of the buckle. If you just slide things without forcing them tight, and then try to snap-down the QR thingy, bad things happen. Is that them part that seems to be breaking?

Nope, you got it all right. The packs are a bargain if folks go into it knowing the plusses and minuses. The fixes you talked are valid and would indeed address most or maybe all of the things I've experienced. I personally simply choose to use something else that I KNOW won't need that sort of thing, so I can put that time and energy and attention elsewhere.

I just turned my assault pack inside out and the only seams not finished with ribbon are where the 2 side panels meet at the bottoms of the main compartment zipper, and at the bottom of the larger outside pocket where it attaches to the main pack. So it looks like I have about 16" of edge to melt sometime soon.

I got some of the woodland camo gen 2 assault packs, (double antenna ports). Since I don't do combat patrols right now they work great for my daily needs. I have one set up as a go bag for work, one set up as a bail out bag, and several extras. The most weight I have put in them has been 44 pounds. The straps weren't the most comfortable but it was ok for the weekend. I manage to mount 2 sustainment pouches to one of the packs for extra gear when needed. The other one has the GP/canteen pouches on it and a FAK and a few other smaller MOLLE pouches. My daily weight I carry is 20 to 25 Lbs in my pack. For a daily cheap pack its a great deal.

That being said I do have others to choose from that are more comfortable to wear for longer periods of time if needed. I humped the old LBE , butt pack and Large Alice ruck back in the day I wish we had some of the gear the troops have today.I think its a great improvement from the Vietnam era stuff I used.

Anyway thanks for the info RAF I enjoyed it. I will have to shop around and see if I can find a new assault packs to try....
RLTW

One of my assault packs with waist pack,and 2 sustainment pouches mounted

Yep

i am a former Infantry Soldier and when i served i used ALICE but now i use MOLLE kit more often lately...i have a G.I. ACU Molle Assault pack with everything factory taped up and properly sewn...i picked it up at a gun show here in the valley for $50 American dollars New....i assume it's the later generation of equipment were the problems were addressed and corrected....i have just been using it from home to work to carry my hand tools, lunch, water bottle and outer clothing etc....i have taken it to the range but not the field yet... i realy like the PALS and texture and sturdyness of the pack fabric...i just wish the shoulder straps were replaceable encase they got damaged...vince g. 11B Infantry...

I have three of these "assault packs". I bought them for $25 apiece about two years ago, they are Desert Pattern. One of them is my "workout" pack. I have loaded a couple of sandbags (about 15 pounds or so) into the main compartment and walk in the park with it. The shoulder straps are comfortable enough and I have used it this way for about a year now- 5 days a week, 5 miles per day. No problems. The other two I have set up for my kids when we go hiking and they seem to work well enough for them but they are not carrying much weight in honesty.

I've seen some different QR buckles for shoulder straps in my time, and frankly, that isn't one of the better ones, IMHO.

Thing is, it is way too easy to damage it. If the troop is properly trained to re-assemble it right, and doesn't use it every time they doff their pack, then it is all right. Other than that, I can see it breaking often, primarily to abuse brought about by lack of proper training.

Combo of marginal design and insufficient training. IOW, it is not Soldier/Marine-proof, meaning no disrespect. I do know that many times folks are issued equipment and given marginal training in its' use.
I also know that there are some folks who could accidentally break an anvil.

Well, I do admire your creativity in managing to mount Sustainment pouches to the sides of the assault pack, but I think, and no offense intended, that filling them, the pack itself, and the waistpack might be stressing the assault pack beyond its' original design requirements.

I added a waistpack to the bottom of mine, a couple of canteen/utility pouches to the sides, and figured it was enough. Again, and no offense intended, but if one has to add THAT much extra capacity to a small pack, it might be time to consider a larger pack that was originally designed to carry such loads. YMMV.

there are a few spots on the GI pack that can use some TLC/melting/searing, but allow me to suggest that before you go to work on your pack you FIRST do some practice TLC/searing/melting on something smaller and less expensive, such as a pouch or the like.

As with anything, there is a learning period with using a bic lighter on your gear, and it might be best to learn on expendable stuff first before working on your more expensive pack.

I have exhausted many Bic lighters doing finishing work on gear, and it is one thing for me to say it is easy having done it so many times, but another thing for someone to set into their gear with zero experience. The last thing i would want is to see someone ruin some gear on account of my saying that doing some bic-refinishing was so easy that there was NOTHING to it. There IS a bit of learning involved, so practice on expendable stuff first, OK?

I published a thread specifically on this subject some time ago. Let me see if I can find it. BRB.

Sorry, can't find the post, I will re-post, and non-archive it.
Suffice it to say, practice on expendable stuff first.

Oh, I've melted frayed edges on my large ALICE, I know there's more to it than simply sticking the flame into a bundle of fibers. It works a lot better if you don't actually let the flame touch them, and just use the heat 1/4" or so above the flame to fuse them. I've found the grill lighters work best for the job.

Sounds like you have the basics in-hand. My compliments; you know more about this subject than most.

I have used the Gen III assault packs for 72hr BOBs and I like them. They have a good fit for me and are sturdy (and dang cheap at $30 bucks!). I have done some mods to mine, though minor make them more versatile. I remove the plastic sheet , punch 2 holes and do a foldover of kydex and match up the holes. (See pic)




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I removed the black foam pad and placed it over a USGI green sleeping pad and cut the contour. I then placed it all back into the slot minus the black pad. I cut off the long straps leaving the drag handle. I put in a water bladder attached to some 550 cord through the holes in the sheet and run the hose out the radio slot and velcro it down. Waterproof bag liner and pouches/containers to compartmentalize the gear as needed. I also have attachment locations wherever I pretty much need them. I don't get any movement of the bladder (I can even strap it down with slots in sheet) and the thicker pad allows me comfort as well as something to remove for sleeping/ sitting in cold weather.

I did have to go at it with my lighter to get all the threads gone but what military guy hasn't taken a lighter to their new stuff to clean up the threads even on uniforms?

The next comparable price to this new, unissued, desert camo pack runs at about 200 bucks. I have 3 of them for myself and wife and an extra in case. I hate camo but I can live with it this time.

Good idea about the upper tie-down for the bladder. I also substituted GI foam pad for thinner, black, OEM pad in one of my packs, and doubled-up the black pads in the other. More comfy, for sure.

No offense taken RAF. I put the sustainment pouches on the pack just to see if it would work. I used them for a poncho/liner and some other light weight items. It worked for a weekend trip so I was happy. I have larger packs for extended trips that I use. My daily carry pack just has the canteen pouches on the sides and those are plenty. I like the option of the waist pack if needed. Over all for what I do daily this is a good deal. I hope the thread helps some others out there on a budget.
RLTW

I'm still stuck figuring out which ones are the ruck and which ones the assault pack. Anyone have a link to a $30 assault pack that's not a radio bag?

Pics of the MOLLE II rucksack and assault pack.

The rucksack is the latest style, with integral sleep system compartment on the bottom. The "bulkhead" between the main compartment and sleep system compartment can be folded aside to make one large compartment. Not shown are the sustainment pouches, which attach to the sides of the rucksack. The assault pack can be attached to the back of the rucksack.

I would love to find a few more of that style new in DCU!! I don't need anything but the rucksacks

Try looking at www.unclesamsretailoutlet.com

I got mine on eBay from seller "cal army navy." I don't know if they have a store, I'd be surprised if they didn't but you never know.

I sent the seller a question today asking if he had anymore. No answer yet.
ETA Search his ebay listings all he had was ACU and He use to have a website but it no longer exist.

one thing on the ACU pattern army issued assault packs.

do NOT try to Rit dye them brown (ie in order to make it a color that doesn't suck and will blend in to more than a gravel parking lot at dusk)

it will turn purple. not a little purple, but a nice, dark, fuck-purple.


just thought y'all should know

I just found that http://www.pxsupply.com has free shipping on all their domestic orders! They have some great MOLLE backpacks... anyway, thought I'd share it with you! I know I'd want to know about free shipping if I was paying for a nice backpack.

Thanks!

Sorry! Here's the link: http://www.pxsupply.com

never knew bushmaster made packs

That's a good one right there!

I dragged mine around A-stan for two years and it never had any issues. Big enough for a day or twos worth of essentials. Its worth it to configure it with some additional pouches for additional capacity.

I love mine, I use it for hunting. I zip tie it to my alice pack frame.

Might add a little more to this thread in a bit.

Well, here we go with some simple, but much-needed mods to the MOLLE Patrol Pack. This is the Gen I version of the small MOLLE pack; Gen II adds antenna ports, and Gen III is a more elaborate, larger, and better-made unit. Still, we can improve the Gen I version and make it almost as good as the Gen III unit. And for cheap.

First step is to sew-in grosgrain ribbon around the unfinished fabric edges inside the pack––not pictured. This eliminates seam-blowout, and reinforces the shoulder strap attachment points. This done, the main complaints about this pack's durability are addressed.

The pic below shows the MOLLE radio pouch installed within the pack. doing so provides some internal organiztion, and the straps within the RP will accept a water bladder.


One thing the Gen I pack lacks is the compression straps of the Gen III pack. Besides compressing a less-than-full pack, these straps also take stress off the zippers, and provide backup in case the zipper fails.

The pic below shows one attachment point for the top horizontal compression strap, and the field-expedient buckle used to anchor the second, lower, horizontal compression strap. BTW, you can make your own field-expedient buckles.


The pic below shows the dorsal view of both upper and lower horizontal straps. Note that the straps will compress the pack, the outside dorsal pouch, and the side pouches all at once.

Note also the use of MOLLE 100-rd pouches on the sides of the pack, and the use of the MOLLE waist pack on the bottom of the pack. The tri-glide buckles are used to anchor the loose ends of the compression straps.



The pic below shows the adjustable, field-expedient, side-release buckles used to anchor the horizontal compression straps on the opposite side of the pack.



The Pic below shows the quick detach, adjustable, field-expedient buckles used to anchor the vertical compression straps on the top portion if the pack.
One is in place already. The non-adjustable end of the buckles is attached to preexisting webbing used to attach the entire Patrol pack to the main rucksack


The below pic shows the lower anchor points of the vertical compression straps attached, via use of a tri-glide buckle, to preexisting webbing.


Now, we'll add a belly band, which serves to anchor the pack to one's body. Very useful while running, and also useful in rough terrain to prevent the pack from shifting, and possibly throwing the user off-balance.
As before, we'll use a field-expedient buckle to anchor both ends of the belly band, one side of which is shown below, attached to preexisting webbing on the bottom side of the pack. Lower, ladder-lock buckle is the anchor point. The excess webbing will be back-threaded through the buckle to lock the webbing in place.



Below is the installed belly band, fastened by a dual-adjust, side release buckle. since the belly band does not bear any appreciable weight, the strap can be a narrow one. Plenty of webbing left over for heavy winter garments.


All these mods can be made to most any pack, but packs with lots of PALS webbing lend themselves to this sort of user-modification. All of this is done without any sewing, and is completely reversible, if desired.
Use these tricks as a guide to mods that YOUR gear might need.

Tactical-colored buckles, etc., available from http://www.supplycaptain.com, and webbing from http://www.strapworks.com.

Disclaimer: no financial interest.

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