Archived Posts » 59,646,491
SLR 106UR Pros & Cons
3/29/2010 10:38:36 PM
Ok I always liked the 7.62X39 AK and I have always wanted a Krink. Well I came across a good deal on a Bulgarian SLR 106UR in 5.56. So I plan to SBR it. What are the benifits of the 5.56 round in a Krink length BBL. I always thought the bigger the heavier the round the better out of a short BBL. Is the 106UR a good Krink. Like the weight difference for hiking and long carries.
Is the SLR 106UR a reliable Krink?
I'd like to hear from those who have experience and time with the SLR 106UR. What are the Pros & Cons?
Thanks,
Bill
Is the SLR 106UR a reliable Krink?
I'd like to hear from those who have experience and time with the SLR 106UR. What are the Pros & Cons?
Thanks,
Bill
3/29/2010 11:16:39 PM
The main con (once SBRed) is 8.5 inch barrel shooting 5.56. In the AR world, the standard shortest barrel is 10.5 inches (there are smaller...) which has pretty poor ballistics past 100m. If I remember correctly, xm193 will only fragment reliably out of a 10.5 at some ridiculous distance........ like 17 meters.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
3/30/2010 6:11:12 PM
A 8.5 inch 5.56 SBR will pretty much only make for a good paper puncher. The 5.56 round does its damage by fragmenting, and it depends on high velocity to make that fragmentation happen.
I'm sure it'll be a fun gun at the range, but I wouldn't reach for it in a firefight.
I'd sell my 5.45 kit built Krink in a second to get a 107UR, but I'll pass on the 106UR.
I'm sure it'll be a fun gun at the range, but I wouldn't reach for it in a firefight.
I'd sell my 5.45 kit built Krink in a second to get a 107UR, but I'll pass on the 106UR.
3/30/2010 6:42:41 PM
Do you think it would help things in a shorter barrel to use something like Hornady's TAP hollow point ammo? I have a 7.5" AR, and was wondering if something like 75 gr. TAP HP would be better for it. I really only have that gun because it's fun and looks cool, but I wouldn't hesitate to use it defensively if I had to.
4/2/2010 10:14:43 PM
Originally Posted By fike:
The main con (once SBRed) is 8.5 inch barrel shooting 5.56. In the AR world, the standard shortest barrel is 10.5 inches (there are smaller...) which has pretty poor ballistics past 100m. If I remember correctly, xm193 will only fragment reliably out of a 10.5 at some ridiculous distance........ like 17 meters.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
The main con (once SBRed) is 8.5 inch barrel shooting 5.56. In the AR world, the standard shortest barrel is 10.5 inches (there are smaller...) which has pretty poor ballistics past 100m. If I remember correctly, xm193 will only fragment reliably out of a 10.5 at some ridiculous distance........ like 17 meters.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
If you don't know the numbers, why are you throwing made up ones out? Not to mention there are plenty of options in 8 and 7.5 inch barrels. Used to be a 4 inch barrel option, but I don't think anyone is making that any more.
The short barreled 5.56s are less then ideal for stopping power, however they do work. They are best employed like a SMG.
Now for example, look at the barrel lengths of the following rifles:
G36c 9 in.
Micro Galil ~8in
Mini Beryl 9 in
Sig 552 9 in.
Rumor is that the Brits are thinking about adopting a 8 inch 5.56 LWRC PSD carbine.
Even the 106UR would not be produced unless there was SOME demand for it.
Handy short 5.56 carbines have better shootability then pistol, and put out more stopping power. They are handy and compact and you can stuff them in places you cant stick a full size rifle.
Most importantly they are fun. Decide what you need and want, then get what fills that need.
4/2/2010 11:26:23 PM
Originally Posted By Postal0311:
If you don't know the numbers, why are you throwing made up ones out? Not to mention there are plenty of options in 8 and 7.5 inch barrels. Used to be a 4 inch barrel option, but I don't think anyone is making that any more.
The short barreled 5.56s are less then ideal for stopping power, however they do work. They are best employed like a SMG.
Now for example, look at the barrel lengths of the following rifles:
G36c 9 in.
Micro Galil ~8in
Mini Beryl 9 in
Sig 552 9 in.
Rumor is that the Brits are thinking about adopting a 8 inch 5.56 LWRC PSD carbine.
Even the 106UR would not be produced unless there was SOME demand for it.
Handy short 5.56 carbines have better shootability then pistol, and put out more stopping power. They are handy and compact and you can stuff them in places you cant stick a full size rifle.
Most importantly they are fun. Decide what you need and want, then get what fills that need.
Originally Posted By fike:
The main con (once SBRed) is 8.5 inch barrel shooting 5.56. In the AR world, the standard shortest barrel is 10.5 inches (there are smaller...) which has pretty poor ballistics past 100m. If I remember correctly, xm193 will only fragment reliably out of a 10.5 at some ridiculous distance........ like 17 meters.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
The main con (once SBRed) is 8.5 inch barrel shooting 5.56. In the AR world, the standard shortest barrel is 10.5 inches (there are smaller...) which has pretty poor ballistics past 100m. If I remember correctly, xm193 will only fragment reliably out of a 10.5 at some ridiculous distance........ like 17 meters.
In 5.56, inches count. The difference ballistically between a 10.5 and a 12.5 is enough to make many people consider the 12.5 the best combination of size and ballistics. In a gun fight, I'd rather have a shotgun over a 8.5 5.56.
If you don't know the numbers, why are you throwing made up ones out? Not to mention there are plenty of options in 8 and 7.5 inch barrels. Used to be a 4 inch barrel option, but I don't think anyone is making that any more.
The short barreled 5.56s are less then ideal for stopping power, however they do work. They are best employed like a SMG.
Now for example, look at the barrel lengths of the following rifles:
G36c 9 in.
Micro Galil ~8in
Mini Beryl 9 in
Sig 552 9 in.
Rumor is that the Brits are thinking about adopting a 8 inch 5.56 LWRC PSD carbine.
Even the 106UR would not be produced unless there was SOME demand for it.
Handy short 5.56 carbines have better shootability then pistol, and put out more stopping power. They are handy and compact and you can stuff them in places you cant stick a full size rifle.
Most importantly they are fun. Decide what you need and want, then get what fills that need.
That better?
Feel free to post xm193 fragmentation distances out of a 10.5 inch barrel.......
OP, don't hesitate to buy or SBR a 106UR. It will be an awesome gun. I just wanted to give you an honest answer on the biggest "con" against the gun.
All data below is muzzle velocity.
MK 262 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________________
7.5" 2053 FPS ... 10.5" 2363 FPS
DIFFERENCE 310 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 103 FPS
10.5" 2363 FPS ... 14.5" 2576 FPS
DIFFERENCE 213 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 53 FPS
14.5" 2576 FPS ... 16" 2669 FPS
DIFFERENCE 93 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 62 FPS
16" 2669 FPS ... 18" 2769 FPS
DIFFERENCE 100 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 50 FPS
18" 2769 FPS ... 20" 2818 FPS
DIFFERENCE 49 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 25 FPS
M855 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________
7.5" 2244 FPS ... 10.5" 2639 FPS
DIFFERENCE 395 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 132 FPS
10.5" 2639 FPS ... 14.5" 2861 FPS
DIFFERENCE 222 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 56 FPS
14.5" 2861 FPS ... 16" 2938 FPS
DIFFERENCE 77 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 51 FPS
16" 2938 FPS ... 18" 3046 FPS
DIFFERENCE 108 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 54 FPS
18" 3046 FPS ... 20" 3061 FPS
DIFFERENCE 15 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 7.5 FPS
XM193 VELOCITY DATA
_________________________________
7.5" 2364 FPS ... 10.5" 2755 FPS
DIFFERENCE 391 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 130 FPS PER INCH
10.5" 2755 FPS ... 14.5" 2984 FPS
DIFFERENCE 229 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 57 FPS PER INCH
14.5" 2984 FPS ... 16" 3075 FPS
DIFFERENCE 91 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 61 FPS
16" 3075 FPS ... 18" 3245 FPS
DIFFERENCE 170 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 85 FPS
18" 3245 ... 20" 3254 FPS
DIFFERENCE 9 FPS
DIFFERENCE/INCH 4.5 FPS
4/3/2010 12:13:01 AM
Originally Posted By fike:
MK 262 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________________
7.5" 2053 FPS
M855 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________
7.5" 2244 FPS
XM193 VELOCITY DATA
_________________________________
7.5" 2364 FPS
MK 262 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________________
7.5" 2053 FPS
M855 VELOCITY DATA
__________________________
7.5" 2244 FPS
XM193 VELOCITY DATA
_________________________________
7.5" 2364 FPS
Yea that's more like it!
Side note, 5.7 is often noted for having a 28-30 gr bullet going 2350FPS from the P90. 1700-2100 from the Pistol.
Now a quote from the Ammo Oracle
Ammo Oracle:
Testing by combat surgeon Col. Martin L. Fackler, MD (USA Medical Corps, retired), determined that M193 and M855 bullets need to strike flesh at 2,700 feet per second in order to reliably fragment. Between 2,500 fps and 2,700 fps, the bullet may or may not fragment and below 2,500 fps, no significant fragmentation is likely to occur. If there isn't enough velocity to cause fragmentation, the result is a deep, 22 caliber hole, except an area where the yawing occurred, where the diameter of the hole grows briefly to the length of the bullet.
Testing by combat surgeon Col. Martin L. Fackler, MD (USA Medical Corps, retired), determined that M193 and M855 bullets need to strike flesh at 2,700 feet per second in order to reliably fragment. Between 2,500 fps and 2,700 fps, the bullet may or may not fragment and below 2,500 fps, no significant fragmentation is likely to occur. If there isn't enough velocity to cause fragmentation, the result is a deep, 22 caliber hole, except an area where the yawing occurred, where the diameter of the hole grows briefly to the length of the bullet.
Thing is, as the Ammo Oracle points out and other expert will attest to, is that humans are not made of ballistic gel. We have bones, organs of various densities, etc. Hollow points and fragmenting bullets open or break apart best in the belly where there is more liquid and soft tissues. However more of the hardware we want to break is located in the upper torso where there are bones. Things like lungs don't react to bullets the same way that muscle does.
In the end, it relies on shot placement. You need to destroy important items like the heart, lungs, spine, brain stem, or cause enough damage that the body stops working from shock or bleeding out.
How do we do that? Well marksmanship and volume. Hence why we should run these shorty AK's and AR15s much the same way we would have run a MP5 in the past. Multiple rounds center of chest to the bad guys.
The major advantage of weapons like the MK18 and the AKSU is that they retain the same manual of arms as the larger parent rifle. Someone trained on the M16 or the AK can easily use the shortened version with out extra training, vs. learning to use a MP5.
A secondary advantage is commonality of ammo, mags. This combined with the greater practical hit range and increased power(armor penetration too) from the rifle caliber carbines to the pistol caliber SMGs has really pushed the SMG into a nitch role.
4/4/2010 12:43:55 AM
I know some here have a 106UR. Please let me know how is the reliability. Are they ammo or mag sensitive. The 5 round mag that came with mine is a nightmare. Case head rides to low causing the bolt to ride over the round,or catching the case mid way. I have ordered a new 30 round Bulgarian wafle mag. I hope this will function well once I get the new mag. The only two clips on you tube are jammers. This concerns me with the factory 5 round mag I have.
So how are these reliably?
So how are these reliably?
4/4/2010 1:36:12 AM
Originally Posted By gsd2053:
I know some here have a 106UR. Please let me know how is the reliability. Are they ammo or mag sensitive. The 5 round mag that came with mine is a nightmare. Case head rides to low causing the bolt to ride over the round,or catching the case mid way. I have ordered a new 30 round Bulgarian wafle mag. I hope this will function well once I get the new mag. The only two clips on you tube are jammers. This concerns me with the factory 5 round mag I have.
So how are these reliably?
I know some here have a 106UR. Please let me know how is the reliability. Are they ammo or mag sensitive. The 5 round mag that came with mine is a nightmare. Case head rides to low causing the bolt to ride over the round,or catching the case mid way. I have ordered a new 30 round Bulgarian wafle mag. I hope this will function well once I get the new mag. The only two clips on you tube are jammers. This concerns me with the factory 5 round mag I have.
So how are these reliably?
Ah, I see you already saw the YouTube clips... I was watching those earlier today, and wondering if that was a common thing or if they just got bad ones.
4/4/2010 10:28:18 AM
Originally Posted By grimhollow:
Ah, I see you already saw the YouTube clips... I was watching those earlier today, and wondering if that was a common thing or if they just got bad ones.
Originally Posted By gsd2053:
I know some here have a 106UR. Please let me know how is the reliability. Are they ammo or mag sensitive. The 5 round mag that came with mine is a nightmare. Case head rides to low causing the bolt to ride over the round,or catching the case mid way. I have ordered a new 30 round Bulgarian wafle mag. I hope this will function well once I get the new mag. The only two clips on you tube are jammers. This concerns me with the factory 5 round mag I have.
So how are these reliably?
I know some here have a 106UR. Please let me know how is the reliability. Are they ammo or mag sensitive. The 5 round mag that came with mine is a nightmare. Case head rides to low causing the bolt to ride over the round,or catching the case mid way. I have ordered a new 30 round Bulgarian wafle mag. I hope this will function well once I get the new mag. The only two clips on you tube are jammers. This concerns me with the factory 5 round mag I have.
So how are these reliably?
Ah, I see you already saw the YouTube clips... I was watching those earlier today, and wondering if that was a common thing or if they just got bad ones.
There were some problems early in the production of 106s with bad bullet guides or lack there of. Some of the AK fraternity was able to figure out the effected serial number range. Do a search and you will probably find some info on the prefixes that possibly had issues.
That said, I have a 106F that falls into the "bad" serial number range that has only given me a problem once and it was the same "bolt riding over round" issue that gsd2053 experienced. I started loading 28 rounds instead of 30 and haven't had a problem in over 800 rounds.
4/6/2010 2:52:17 PM
I have a SLR106UR which I really like. No malfunction of anykind w/ clear, black Bulgarian mags shooting different ammo. I even used the converted EG 5.45 mag w/ .223 follower w/ no problem. The carbine is very light and handy though especially w/ triangle stock- lighter than my Bushmaster M4. I read that other 106 series had some problems at the begining, not sure if it related to "UR" in particular.
I also had SLR107UR but recoil was brutal out of such a small/light carbine.
Yes, I thought K-var ad was for 5.45 cal- too bad!
I also had SLR107UR but recoil was brutal out of such a small/light carbine.
Yes, I thought K-var ad was for 5.45 cal- too bad!
4/8/2010 7:36:07 PM
OK, I just received 2 Bulgarian Waffle 30 RND'ers . It was a Fubar 5 round Mag that came with the Krink. I knew it was Fubar, but with only one Mag. One that is fubar. It is hard to check the rest of the function. It Functions Awesome now. I am so happy. What is the proper 106ur 5>56 Krink BBL length, and who in DFW area can I trust to SBR this thing right? I am so happy. I love the rock solid poly stock. It is awsome open and folded. However, how is the steel triangle. I know its gotta be light. Man I am so high right now. 
4/8/2010 10:35:39 PM
I have an early 106UR that is now SBR that will only function reliably with the smoke/clear Bulgarian mags, the black mags have a couple of hicups per mag. What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp?
4/9/2010 12:37:33 AM
Originally Posted By gsd2053:
OK, I just received 2 Bulgarian Waffle 30 RND'ers . It was a Fubar 5 round Mag that came with the Krink. I knew it was Fubar, but with only one Mag. One that is fubar. It is hard to check the rest of the function. It Functions Awesome now. I am so happy. What is the proper 106ur 5>56 Krink BBL length, and who in DFW area can I trust to SBR this thing right? I am so happy. I love the rock solid poly stock. It is awsome open and folded. However, how is the steel triangle. I know its gotta be light. Man I am so high right now.
OK, I just received 2 Bulgarian Waffle 30 RND'ers . It was a Fubar 5 round Mag that came with the Krink. I knew it was Fubar, but with only one Mag. One that is fubar. It is hard to check the rest of the function. It Functions Awesome now. I am so happy. What is the proper 106ur 5>56 Krink BBL length, and who in DFW area can I trust to SBR this thing right? I am so happy. I love the rock solid poly stock. It is awsome open and folded. However, how is the steel triangle. I know its gotta be light. Man I am so high right now.
What is the proper 106ur 5>56 Krink BBL length - 8 1/2 inches
who in DFW area can I trust to SBR this thing right? - A lot of people do it themselves (cut/recrown)Thread here. If it were me, I'd send it to an AK specilist and while it's there have them refinish it in something tougher.
how is the steel triangle - The triangle is awesome. It's thin and offers a great (classic) look. That said, it isn't as comfortable in heat/cold and is a pain to unlatch vs. the push button on the polymer.
Originally Posted By Avtomat32:
I have an early 106UR that is now SBR that will only function reliably with the smoke/clear Bulgarian mags, the black mags have a couple of hicups per mag. What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp?
I have an early 106UR that is now SBR that will only function reliably with the smoke/clear Bulgarian mags, the black mags have a couple of hicups per mag. What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp?
What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? - The clear mags are 3rd Generation and GTG. The black mags are 1st/2nd Gen and have a tendency to not function very well in most rifles. Most folks error on the side of caution and buy the clear mags.
Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp? - If the gun functions fine with clear mags it probably doesn't need a feed ramp modification.
4/9/2010 11:48:15 AM
Fike, you have been a great source of info here. I just wanted to say THANKS. I thought there was a way to give points/reps to members for thier helpfull posts/contributions. How do I do this?
Next I thought the only difference between the clear smoked and the Black poly was the black poly had steel reinforcment. Are the smoked better constructed? I was under the impression that the BLK circle 10 mags were current Bulg millitary? and the smoked were commercial? I would love to find some metal mags that would last a lot longet than the plastic. As long as they would function reliably. Source?
Next I thought the only difference between the clear smoked and the Black poly was the black poly had steel reinforcment. Are the smoked better constructed? I was under the impression that the BLK circle 10 mags were current Bulg millitary? and the smoked were commercial? I would love to find some metal mags that would last a lot longet than the plastic. As long as they would function reliably. Source?
4/9/2010 11:51:21 AM
Avtomat are you in DFW area and who did your SBR work?
Originally Posted By Avtomat32:
I have an early 106UR that is now SBR that will only function reliably with the smoke/clear Bulgarian mags, the black mags have a couple of hicups per mag. What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp?
I have an early 106UR that is now SBR that will only function reliably with the smoke/clear Bulgarian mags, the black mags have a couple of hicups per mag. What is going on here with the preference for the clear mag? Who can I send it to that will modify the feed ramp?
4/18/2010 10:35:56 PM
I just got one this weekend. I am very pleased with the fit and finish and after putting 155 rounds through it not one problem.
4/25/2010 7:33:54 PM
The 106ur is the size of a SMG but it shoots a rifle cartridge...
Compare the 5.56 to any SMG round and it is far supperior, even with a 8.5" bbl it will penetrate body armor that a smg will not.
Compare the 5.56 to even the 5.45 with that short of a bbl and it falls short, compare it to the 7.62 and well... theres no comparison...
That being said I have a 5.45 and a 7.62 and Im looking to pick up one of the 106urs simply because the Krink is my FAVORITE weapon so when D-Day happens and I run out of 5.45 and 7.62 I can go to .223 while still shooting the "same" weapon
Size, weight, balance and carryabilty is awesome. I have a AR-SBR with a 7.5" bbl (its a toy) I wouldn't trust my life on it, on the other hand if the 106ur is anywhere near the reliability of any AK Im sold!
I don't think they make the ARs a minimum of 10.5" for ballistics, I think its the fact that they cant get the damn thing to work reliably any shorter than that
So if you want the most compact and reliable (if as reliable as other Kalashnikovs) 5.56 on the market I think You've found it
Compare the 5.56 to any SMG round and it is far supperior, even with a 8.5" bbl it will penetrate body armor that a smg will not.
Compare the 5.56 to even the 5.45 with that short of a bbl and it falls short, compare it to the 7.62 and well... theres no comparison...
That being said I have a 5.45 and a 7.62 and Im looking to pick up one of the 106urs simply because the Krink is my FAVORITE weapon so when D-Day happens and I run out of 5.45 and 7.62 I can go to .223 while still shooting the "same" weapon
Size, weight, balance and carryabilty is awesome. I have a AR-SBR with a 7.5" bbl (its a toy) I wouldn't trust my life on it, on the other hand if the 106ur is anywhere near the reliability of any AK Im sold!
I don't think they make the ARs a minimum of 10.5" for ballistics, I think its the fact that they cant get the damn thing to work reliably any shorter than that
So if you want the most compact and reliable (if as reliable as other Kalashnikovs) 5.56 on the market I think You've found it
5/21/2010 7:21:13 PM
I have a SBR 106UR and I love it. It has a place as a my PSD/EP weapon, very handy.
6/1/2010 12:13:11 AM
OK well I actually got to try to shoot it SAT. It has a severe gas problem. I am guessing the port is misaligned or the wrong size. It is short stroking terribly. It’s like a complicated Single shot. I will be sending it back to Arsenal. ASAP. I hope they fix it without as runn around. This will fall under the CON's side!
6/6/2010 1:16:36 AM
Alright, I am concidering laping the carrier and hammer contact surface areas to smooth them out. And trying some more potent 5.56 ammo before sending it back. Where is all the experience on these SLR-106UR's. I herd that the 5.56 SLR-106UR's did not need the gas port opened up to SBR them. That is what I was planing to do with this one. However if it is short stroking with its 16" BBL?
I guess there just are not enough of the sold to get get enough feed back on them.
I guess there just are not enough of the sold to get get enough feed back on them.
7/3/2010 9:46:35 AM
I use the 106UR on security details for 2 years now. I only have one problem with the gun, it ocassionally has FTF, about once every mag on the black circle 10 mags. It is flawless on the smoke mags with 500 rounds fired without a single malfunction.
7/18/2010 11:39:24 AM
Ok, Well I used a lapping compound on the hammer and the carrier contact points. Cleaned it up and sprayed some CLP on it. Flawless. Simply flawless. It runs like a raped ape now. The hammer and carrier had a rough contact point. That was robbing the momentum of the extraction process. It runs perfect on the two blk circle 10 thirty rounders. I fired 10 Remington soft point loads though it first. I figured the had more power than the Tula and Wolf. I then fired 30 rounds of Wolf then 30 rounds of Tula. All ran flawlessly. I ran 310 rounds without a single problem. I even folded the stock held it loosely beside myself and fired a few mags through it to see if the week hold on the rifle would produce a failure and it fan 100%. The rifle has gained my trust as reliable. I hope this helps anyone who may encounter this issue.
Thanks, Bill
Thanks, Bill
